What do you get when you cross an alternative rock band with dance-punk vibes, bold beats, two Belgian brothers surrounded by a jungle of synths, and a burning urge to do your own thing and ignore the genre rulebook? Simple maths: you get Soulwax. The ever-shifting band, DJ duo, and producers who’ve been flipping the music world on its head since the late ‘90s.
Now, Soulwax can mean two things. There’s Soulwax live: a full band on stage, loud, sweaty, electric. And then there’s Soulwax the duo: the core, the control centre, the four ears and twenty fingers in a studio in Ghent. That’s Stephen and David Dewaele, the two brothers behind it all. The only permanent members. The mad scientists mixing up an innovative and eclectic blend of electronic, punk, and rock.
Together, they produce and mix everything that comes out of their own label, Deewee. They’ve been nominated for Grammys for remixes of legends like The Rolling Stones and buzzy newcomers like Wet Leg. They co-created the Despacio Sound System. And just now, they’ve dropped their sixth album, All Systems Are Lying, a record that sometimes sounds like Soulwax… and sometimes doesn’t at all. Made entirely with modular synths, live drums, vocals, tape machines – and not a single guitar in sight – the album dives deep into a familiar question: is what we see real? Or is it not?
A few days before the release, we hopped on a video call with the brothers. They’re lounging in their studio, each in a huge, comfy-looking chair on wheels. Behind them, in front of them, basically everywhere, are machines, wires, buttons. All the stuff they used to build the new album. They’re a bit late (lots of interviews today), but they show up looking relaxed and in good spirits. No signs of stress. They take their time answering the questions, and while their responses are sharp and straight to the point, nothing feels canned or rehearsed.
So, while Stephen and David roll around in front of their screen, we chat about All Systems Are Lying, about good and bad, about rules that don’t apply to everyone, about conspiracy theories, and about going with the flow.
Hi guys, first I want to know: What’s the most un-Soulwax guilty pleasure song you’ve listened to in the past week?
David: I’m wondering if there’s anything good in my Spotify history. [checks phone] Ah, no. Up until now, it’s all cool stuff.
Stephen: I was listening to INXS. There’s a new remastered album, an old record of theirs, and it has all these demos on it. And there’s one demo track that’s pretty amazing: I’m Over You. That really blew my mind.
David: I don’t have a guilty pleasure, to be honest. I’m sorry. Also, I don’t believe in that concept. If you like it, then you shouldn’t feel guilty.
Stephen: I was listening to INXS. There’s a new remastered album, an old record of theirs, and it has all these demos on it. And there’s one demo track that’s pretty amazing: I’m Over You. That really blew my mind.
David: I don’t have a guilty pleasure, to be honest. I’m sorry. Also, I don’t believe in that concept. If you like it, then you shouldn’t feel guilty.
Your new album is titled All Systems Are Lying. Does this title, this sentence, feel like irony, frustration, or acceptance right now?
Stephen: After all these interviews, it seems like it resonates with a lot of people. People find a lot of meaning in it. But when we came up with it, it wasn’t really meant to be a statement per se. It was just what was happening in the studio. It was a sentence we threw around every time something didn’t work the way we wanted it to.
David: I mean, the way I interpret it is just like everyone else: we’re just trying to survive. We’re constantly trying to adjust. I’m not a sociopolitical genius here, but there’s a huge shift happening on every level. Life and the world itself are changing so fast. Faster than we, as middle-aged men, have ever known in our lives. Technology, politics, economies. It makes you feel powerless and overwhelmed sometimes. It’s a feeling that everyone shares. It’s the same for an eighty-year-old as it is for a six-year-old, I think. So, this album is like an antenna. It’s something we picked up on, and just like everyone else, we’re trying to deal with it day by day.
David: I mean, the way I interpret it is just like everyone else: we’re just trying to survive. We’re constantly trying to adjust. I’m not a sociopolitical genius here, but there’s a huge shift happening on every level. Life and the world itself are changing so fast. Faster than we, as middle-aged men, have ever known in our lives. Technology, politics, economies. It makes you feel powerless and overwhelmed sometimes. It’s a feeling that everyone shares. It’s the same for an eighty-year-old as it is for a six-year-old, I think. So, this album is like an antenna. It’s something we picked up on, and just like everyone else, we’re trying to deal with it day by day.
Do you remember the moment you came up with the title?
Stephen: I think we were in the studio with Marie Davidson producing the album and something went wrong. There are a lot of software options for making music now, but in the studio, we have a lot of old machines. And these weren’t talking to each other. The box wasn’t connecting with the real machines. Then, I think Pierre, Marie’s husband, said something like, “The system is lying” or “All systems are lying.” Of course, it was a bit of a joke, but it stuck with us. We kept saying it every time something went wrong. And from that moment on, when we’d go upstairs to sit with the people helping us in the studio, we noticed that one of their biggest anxieties was the question: Is something real or not? Is what I’m seeing real? Is what I’m hearing real? Pierre’s sentence was the perfect way to describe that anxiety.
David: And even more than that, the title sort of implies that you’re being told something is true when it’s actually not. It implies some kind of disappointment. The disappointment all of us felt in the studio sometimes.
David: And even more than that, the title sort of implies that you’re being told something is true when it’s actually not. It implies some kind of disappointment. The disappointment all of us felt in the studio sometimes.
“Sometimes the reason I’m less interested in a song is because I understand how it came about. I like the stuff I don’t know. The stuff where I can never really tell where it came from.” David
Do you have a favourite track on the album?
David: Wow, that’s a good question.
Stephen: Yeah, so simple. It’s a question nobody’s asked us actually.
David: I think for me it’s Run Free. But it’s also really subjective because sometimes the reason I’m less interested in a song is because I understand how it came about. I like the stuff I don’t know. The stuff where I can never really tell where it came from.
Stephen: Yeah, so simple. It’s a question nobody’s asked us actually.
David: I think for me it’s Run Free. But it’s also really subjective because sometimes the reason I’m less interested in a song is because I understand how it came about. I like the stuff I don’t know. The stuff where I can never really tell where it came from.
How about the new album then? Don’t you know where every song came from?
Stephen: No, that’s kind of what we’re trying to explain to people. With this album, Dave and I went into the studio and were like, let’s just see what comes out of this. Normally, we try to make rules, limitations. Like, we’ll record a track in a day. Or, we’ll make a track with a synth. Or we’ll make an album about this. But this time, there were no restrictions. No limitations. It was just whatever we were coming up with.
A lot of the music you hear on this album is just a subjective, intuitive flow. So, in a way, we never know where our songs come from. Of course we can explain a little bit. We can tell the story behind All Systems Are Lying. But in the end, subconsciously, a lot of these themes and ideas were just living in us.
A lot of the music you hear on this album is just a subjective, intuitive flow. So, in a way, we never know where our songs come from. Of course we can explain a little bit. We can tell the story behind All Systems Are Lying. But in the end, subconsciously, a lot of these themes and ideas were just living in us.
It sounds very natural. Very impulsive. Something that comes from within and doesn’t need to be explained every time.
Stephen: Yes, very authentic.
David: Exactly. That’s why I love the entire album, because I can’t entirely explain where it came from.
David: Exactly. That’s why I love the entire album, because I can’t entirely explain where it came from.
What song surprised you the most after you recorded it?
David: The opening track on the record is called Pills and People Gone. Actually, this one transformed from something radically different. Weirdly enough, a lot of the stuff on the album started as almost minimal piano pieces and then became full band tracks. But this one happened in reverse. We started with guitars, bass, and drums, and then it gradually became this weird, soundscape-y piano-Phillip Glass kind of thing.
I also read that there are no electric guitars on the album.
Stephen: Yes, and again, that’s something we weren’t aware of. When we gave the record to the label, someone made a press release. We did an interview with him, and he said, wow, this is a very rock-sounding record you made. And Dave was like, oh yeah, but you know what? We didn’t even play guitar on it. He thought about it because a couple of weeks before, a fan came up to him and said, Dave, I saw you play that song live two years ago and you had a guitar. And now you’re saying you’re not doing it with a guitar. And Dave was like, Yeah, but the guitar was just in the warehouse. We ended up doing it with a synth. So, a lot of our decisions are very spontaneous.
David: Yeah. Nothing pre-planned. Same with the gear. Sometimes we get asked, why did you use this synth for that?
Stephen: Because it was on.
David: Exactly. Someone packed it in and it happens to be working. It’s not like we wake up and think, oh, today we’re going to use the Roland System 700. It’s just whatever is working. Do we like it? Okay, cool, let’s use it.
David: Yeah. Nothing pre-planned. Same with the gear. Sometimes we get asked, why did you use this synth for that?
Stephen: Because it was on.
David: Exactly. Someone packed it in and it happens to be working. It’s not like we wake up and think, oh, today we’re going to use the Roland System 700. It’s just whatever is working. Do we like it? Okay, cool, let’s use it.
So, you’re going with the flow.
David: Yeah, a hundred per cent.
In the song False Economy, there are the lyrics: “Does the good outweigh the bad?” Do you think it does, or does it not?
David: I think the point of that lyric is not for us to give an answer. It’s kind of like with All Systems Are Lying. You’re constantly asking yourself, whatever I’m giving up now, is it worth it?
Stephen: Or is the system we were supposed to believe in actually real? When it comes to the economy, we’re told to be good citizens, to do all these things. But if we find a way to cheat taxes, we’re basically rewarded for it. So, there’s a whole generation that has this idea that there are rules but they don’t apply to everyone. And then the question is, does the good outweigh the bad? This song is about a lot of the power structures we all deal with, and how some of them have never felt true to Dave and I. We’ve always wondered how true they actually are.
David: We can ask you back: does the good outweigh the bad?
Stephen: Or is the system we were supposed to believe in actually real? When it comes to the economy, we’re told to be good citizens, to do all these things. But if we find a way to cheat taxes, we’re basically rewarded for it. So, there’s a whole generation that has this idea that there are rules but they don’t apply to everyone. And then the question is, does the good outweigh the bad? This song is about a lot of the power structures we all deal with, and how some of them have never felt true to Dave and I. We’ve always wondered how true they actually are.
David: We can ask you back: does the good outweigh the bad?
It depends on the context. In memories, for example, people tend to remember more bad stuff than good stuff. So, here the bad outweighs the good. But when it comes to being happy for yourself and interacting with others, people should always try to make the good outweigh the bad.
David: Good answer. That’s probably why you’re writing.
Stephen: And we’re making the music (laughs).
Stephen: And we’re making the music (laughs).
If you always go with the flow in the studio, how do you know when a track is finished?
Stephen: Very, very good question. Maybe it’s because we’re brothers. Maybe that’s why we seem to work efficiently without really having to talk, and why we know when something works for us. Whenever something touches us, we’re good. If we’re doing something and one of us doesn’t like it, we’ll abort it immediately. In the end, we just feel when something’s finished. It’s hard to explain.
David: It’s also a feeling we’re constantly searching for. The feeling of ‘okay, this touches me now’. Sometimes that takes three hours. Sometimes three months. And that can be frustrating, because people will ask us to finish something by next week. And we always say, we’ll try. But we don’t know if we’ll get goosebumps then.
Stephen: Yeah, a lot of people want to be in the studio with Dave and I to see how we work together. But I think it’s sometimes boring for them. There’s no real system to it.
David: It’s also a feeling we’re constantly searching for. The feeling of ‘okay, this touches me now’. Sometimes that takes three hours. Sometimes three months. And that can be frustrating, because people will ask us to finish something by next week. And we always say, we’ll try. But we don’t know if we’ll get goosebumps then.
Stephen: Yeah, a lot of people want to be in the studio with Dave and I to see how we work together. But I think it’s sometimes boring for them. There’s no real system to it.
It makes sense that it’s hard to explain. As an artist, you can probably never fully finish something.
Stephen: Yes, in a way, no track is ever truly finished. But we’ve learned to let it go.
How is it working together? If you have an argument, who usually wins?
David: Who usually wins? No one. Everyone loses.
Stephen: Our disagreements are almost never about the result. It’s almost never about the music. If we disagree, it’s usually about time and how we manage it. Musically, we disagree very little.
David: That’s very true.
Stephen: But being brothers also gives us more time to recover. The other one is always going to be your brother. So, it allows for conflict to not be as explosive as it might be for other people.
Stephen: Our disagreements are almost never about the result. It’s almost never about the music. If we disagree, it’s usually about time and how we manage it. Musically, we disagree very little.
David: That’s very true.
Stephen: But being brothers also gives us more time to recover. The other one is always going to be your brother. So, it allows for conflict to not be as explosive as it might be for other people.
“No track is ever truly finished. But we’ve learned to let it go.” Stephen
You also work with three drummers. What’s harder: syncing three drummers or finding a good song title?
Stephen: Syncing three drummers, without a doubt. That’s a hard thing. We have to rehearse a lot for that. But we’re very, very fortunate to work with such great people – Aurora, Blake, and Igor. Igor, especially, being the drummer from Sepultura, is pretty wild. The fact that he’s in our band is already weird. Blake and Aurora are also strange, but it’s always a bit surreal to have such a legend in your band and make him play music that’s different from what he’s usually doing. Syncing them up is a challenge, but when it works – when the three of them are on stage or we’re recording – they find a synergy that creates something neither Dave nor I could have made on a computer. It’s a very visceral, human element.
Having your own studio, your own label, does that mean creative freedom or increasing pressure for you?
David: Having our own studio and label means creative freedom, of course. But the biggest problem or enemy we have is time. Everyone we work with on this label are friends first and foremost. That constant juggling between projects and telling them, ‘guys, you have to wait a few more weeks’, is a pressure we hate.
Stephen: Yeah, there’s a lot of stuff about to come out on the label. I think the label does give us the freedom to close ourselves off a little from everything going on around us. And it gives us the freedom to come up with some really stupid ideas. By the way, a lot of people we work with are more than happy to tell you about it.
Stephen: Yeah, there’s a lot of stuff about to come out on the label. I think the label does give us the freedom to close ourselves off a little from everything going on around us. And it gives us the freedom to come up with some really stupid ideas. By the way, a lot of people we work with are more than happy to tell you about it.
If Soulwax was a conspiracy theory, what would it be?
Stephen: We’re a conspiracy theory that believes in UFOs. This is the headquarters of UFO Belgium. We collect evidence (laughs). But it’s really interesting to talk about conspiracy theories. It’s frustrating for Dave and I how many people believe in theories without having any foundation or truth. But at the same time, I’m kind of jealous of them. I would love to believe in conspiracy theories. Some of them are amazing but so easily debunked, that I always think, ‘come on, just try a little harder’. But the UFO one is something I can get into here in the studio. As long as you give me evidence, I’m in.
David: Conspiracy theories, by definition, are negative. A lot of them involve believing things that aren’t true. But when it comes to the idea of alien life, I think it’s positive. It’s arrogant to think that our little planet would be the only one with life in the universe. So, maybe it’s not a conspiracy theory. Maybe it’s just logic. A genesis theory.
Stephen: Yeah, after this interview, we’ll go upstairs, have some food, and I’m a hundred per cent sure that if we bring up UFOs, we could change our career path.
David: Conspiracy theories, by definition, are negative. A lot of them involve believing things that aren’t true. But when it comes to the idea of alien life, I think it’s positive. It’s arrogant to think that our little planet would be the only one with life in the universe. So, maybe it’s not a conspiracy theory. Maybe it’s just logic. A genesis theory.
Stephen: Yeah, after this interview, we’ll go upstairs, have some food, and I’m a hundred per cent sure that if we bring up UFOs, we could change our career path.
