They scream like it’s church and the crowd screams back like it’s gospel. Brutalismus 3000 turn chaos and noise into communion that heals something you didn’t know was broken. Some artists perform as if they’re trying to escape their own bodies. Brutalismus 3000 perform as if they’ve been transported to an untethered realm and came back with bruises of joy. The Berlin duo doesn’t just make punk-techno-whatever-you-want-to-call-it; they make loud, aggressive, hardcore music that somehow feels like a hug. It’s rebellion that smells of Byredo perfume; a screaming mosh pit of smeared lipstick and mascara running down faces. They’re loud, rough, and gloriously unbothered. But there’s a calmness in how they move together, like chaos learned Pilates.
Interview tak­en from METAL Magazine issue 53. Adapted for the online version. Order your copy here.
Their shows are a fever dream, lights melting, bass rattling your bones. Thousands entranced, high on punk. Spinning mid-screams and grinning like they’ve found God in the distortion. Brutalismus 3000’s aggression hits as release, not rage. They scream because they love it. Offstage, they’re open, curious, and stupendously kind, the sort of people who make you forget you’re interviewing them and more as if you’re catching up with friends who happen to be the face of hardcore gabber punk. Brutalismus 3000, aka Victoria Vassiliki Daldas and Theo Zeitner, aren’t trying to be the future of punk. They’re proof that the future can still feel human.
Hey you guys, how are you?
Victoria: Good. Hey, how are you?
Theo: We’re good. We’re having some time off, three months now. It’s good keeping it low, no parties. 
I literally just watched a video of your set in Vegas last night.
Theo: That was a party.
I saw. It was pretty awesome! It looked as if you both were having a good time.
Theo and Victoria: Thank you!
How do you feel when you are doing big shows? The production value was so high too.
Theo: This one was one of the biggest so far. We usually prefer it, right? Bigger shows actually make you less nervous.
Really?
Theo: Kind of, because it’s so much further away from everyone, and it’s so surreal. We are coming from a club context that was way more frightening, because everyone is right next to you. Everyone is looking at what you’re doing. So, it’s more four in the morning, you’re dressed up, and on this big stage, you have your team, you’re treated like a little prince, and you play the songs and everyone’s about a hundred metres away.
They were going crazy. They seriously loved you two. Victoria, you were running back and forth on stage, having a good time.
Victoria: After that, I was completely sweaty. That was nice to perform.
This is a whole new genre of music for me; I grew up listening to hip hop and R&B. I want to give you the floor to explain, how did you get into this kind of music? 
Theo: How we got into it is very normal in Berlin, when you go partying. It was not this kind of music, not as hard as we do it back when we started in 2019. But techno was the main music. You would hear it everywhere at every party. And the rap artists from Berlin, they listen to techno as well, because if you go to a party you listen to techno, especially during those intense late-night hours.
Victoria: We liked it, and then we tried it for fun. We liked it so much that we wanted to do it better.
Theo: Our little version of it.
I read about your Tinder story, and I know the media talks about that a lot, but what is your version, not the big sensational story.
Victoria: Two in the morning, drinks and then sticking it together. 
After drinks, huh? 
Victoria: 2am drinks.
Theo: True. It was very spontaneous, very nice. There’s a whole advertisement about it that kind of tells the real story. It’s more glamourized, but it is kind of the real story.
That’s what I mean. I know you did a campaign together; I wanted to hear your version.
Theo: They just cleaned it up a little bit, you know. Instead of the fucked-up bar, it became a nice bar with clean carpets. But basically, that’s how it happened. I didn’t have that big a living room with a 909 in it.
Victoria: That was staged. 
They will do that. When you’re doing your vocals on stage how do you decide your vocal textures, and how you’re going to enunciate? Because when I was watching the Las Vegas show, at one point it seemed you were rapping. 
Victoria: Different influences. We have definitely had some rap parts. For the new album, we have much more trap in it, too. We are also changing a little bit the direction for our new upcoming releases. We have some punk influence, I’m screaming, but there will also be some more melodic new stuff. It was fun for me to explore that, because before, in the beginning, it was punkier, and now I’m finally finding out what I can do with my voice. Actually, I’m excited. I want to do more rapping.
You were good, it surprised me. Shit, she knows how to flow.
Victoria: The last song, right? I like it, I should get more into that.
Theo: We grew into it as well. In the beginning, it was literally what we could do with what we learned. Vicky never learned how to sing. I never learned how to produce. I never had a teacher. Most people have never had a teacher for that. We had a stripped down, minimalistic beat. We had one style of singing in the beginning, and then we expanded and expanded. 
I understand because the more you do it the more you learn and grow.
Theo and Victoria: Yes.
That’s always wonderful. When you’re making a beat, how do you even start? What is your inspiration? 
Theo: It’s very often a minor inspiration. I’ll listen to one track and then go, let’s do something like this. It can be anything; it can be a Beatles track or a techno track. It can be a second of a track that a pad that sounds nice. Then in the end, you try to recreate it, or something similar, but it never ever comes out the way the inspiration was, it is completely different in the end.
Well, sometimes the surprise is where the magic’s at. You think, I didn’t expect that but damn it’s good!
Theo: That’s a hundred percent of our tricks. It never came out the way we planned.
That sense of freedom is punk. Punk can be loud, hard, and chaotic but with the world being so overstimulated and chaotic right now, maybe vulnerability and care have become their own kind of quiet resistance. What do you think about that?
Victoria: For me, tenderness is maybe a new resistance. If you care about yourself, your friends, the world, maybe this is the new punk, to care. Maybe this is the new resistance. 
Exactly, because in the beginning punk was rebellion.
Victoria: But it’s still rebellion. It’s to move forward and not stick to the same patterns.
Theo: Also, rebellion can’t be tender. I like the sentiment of being tender, it’s good to be tender to fellow humans. But we can’t move anything now by being tender. The revolution will not be tender.
How do you feel when you’re on stage? Do you feel you’re being rebellious, that your music is resistance?
Theo: I actually feel more tender on stage. I feel connected with and loved by the crowd and give that love back. When we started, we felt more angsty, but now we know this is the nicest job, you can bring joy.
Victoria: We put the anger out already. Our new music is showing that the anger is out, the music is still aggressive and powerful, but it’s more tender and it fits.
“For me, tenderness is maybe a new resistance. If you care about yourself, your friends, the world, maybe this is the new punk, to care.” — Victoria.
I could tell by the way you both were having fun on stage, and the way you’re jumping and spinning around you are enjoying the crowd. And the crowd was going crazy too! They were loving you.
Theo: That’s nice. Crazy to think about us in Las Vegas, I never even dreamt of being there.
Was it your first time there? 
Victoria: Yeah, it was a fever dream. I remember it, but also, I don’t really remember it. 
Theo: One constant stream of things happening.
How different was that from the Boiler Room?
Theo: Oh, very different. The Boiler Room was very raw. I was way more nervous, because everyone is around you. Also, at that time, we felt we had more to prove. So, it was very different for me. I was shaking the whole day of the boiler room show. The whole week before, we were so fucking nervous.
Victoria: Also, the new sets, like what you heard from Las Vegas, have much more of our own songs. Maybe there’s two or three others. Now we can play a whole set that contains our heart, which is nice.
It was a huge stage, and you had crazy production. It definitely looked fun in Vegas. You were saying, the new direction you’re going in is more melodic. Can you speak on that? 
Theo: There are tracks that are more aggressive and more experimental, but in ways comfortable to musically express ourselves. There are tracks that have a sung melodic chorus, almost pop-y vibe. Then it goes back into the aggressive stuff. There’s stuff that we didn’t know how to do and also didn’t dare to do before. It’s actually less mainstream than before. It’s more experimental, but it does have that melodic touch to it.
Victoria: It has drum and bass parts to break it up but it’s going to be more experimental too.
Theo: Exactly, not everything has to be screamed. We’re exploring other things. But there’s still a lot of screaming, because we love it.
You sing in three different languages, how important was that for you to use different languages in your music?
Victoria: It’s very important, I would say I cannot speak any of those perfectly. Also, some languages are more for specific emotions or things that have happened in my life. It works better if I talk more about family, my parents, if I use different languages. And German can sometimes be more fun.
Theo: German is more the party, because that’s our Berlin experience. If we talk German, it’s about Berlin often.
Victoria: And I haven’t used Greek yet. So, this is still to come. 
Theo: She’s also Greek.
So, you feel that some languages express the emotions better?
Victoria: Some things are easier to say in a specific language because in a different one it can feel too emotional.
Theo: If German is your native language, then it can sound cringe sometimes. But then if you put it in Slavic or English, it sounds good.
Victoria: It’s a feeling, we work and play around with it. 
Was there anything specific that made you feel, I need to write about this moment, an emotion or a memory that shaped a song or captured who you were at a certain point in your life?
Victoria: A lot, actually. It’s about being outside where I grew up. With parents who were foreigners, in Bavaria. It’s very German. What I used for the new album was more of the fun memories. The things I’d already worked through. I focus on the things I like to remember from that time. 
Theo: Really, the album is so sad. It’s less fun than what we did before.
Victoria: Maybe it’s just different in my head. But it’s a little bit, this immigrant kid story. I pick the things I want to tell and pull from that.
Theo: We’ve never had any therapy session lyrics yet. I don’t want to do that, maybe for the tenth record or something. We’re introspective but I don’t think, so far, we have done it.
Some people work through stuff through their music, you’re saying you don’t want to do that, you just want to have fun. You ain’t trying to go to therapy in front of everybody. (Everyone laughs)
Victoria: I want to share what I want to share. I don’t want to dig up anything.
Touring’s a lot, right? It’s fun, but it’s still a grind — flights, no sleep, different cities. What are those little things you both do to make it easier, or keep yourselves sane through all that chaos?
Theo: Everything we do is a routine on tour.
Victoria: Having each other keeps us grounded. Everyone has their moments, and then we have the other person to comfort. That is most important. Also, we’ve learned how to travel. We’re more relaxed now, we know exactly where we want to sit on the plane. 
Theo: Or choosing the type of plane, we’re specific. Anything that helps to smoothen the unnecessary stress that can happen is good for us. I’m not complaining about the job, but it is pretty exhausting. I would say, I’m actually looking forward to touring and traveling. We do the same thing every time, same drink before a flight, and then same little stupid rituals we do before take-off.
You definitely have to have the drink before the flight. What is your go-to drink?
Theo: For me, it’s just beer. Actually, two beers smooth the mood.
Victoria: I love it in America there’s always a barkeeper. Usually, I drink some martinis before because they knock you out. 
Do you rate dirty Martinis?
Victoria: Yes, very dirty! 
I’ll have about three of those. I hate flying
Victoria: Us too. We hate it. I’m also still scared. I need to say.
Theo: It got better for me, for sure. But, once you travel every weekend, it, as expected, gets better. If there is turbulence I’m still scared. Other than that, I’m cool. 
What places have you been most excited to play since you’ve been touring?
Theo: Vegas was a big highlight. And New York always is amazing, because we love the city as well. 
Victoria: I need to say, we have very cute American fans. Colombia was amazing, we did our biggest solo show there, the concert was huge! To have people that far away from Berlin listen to our music is great. Next year we are playing Argentina, Chile, Brazil and Mexico. We’re very excited because apparently, we have a lot of fans on that side of the world. 
The places you named are places I’ve always wanted to go. How do you feel knowing that your music reaches that far across the world?
Victoria: It’s amazing. When I see videos of kids in South America, Latin America, listening to our music, it makes me emotional. Also, we have a very young audience, and I don’t know if they’re going through heartbreaks and loneliness, or problems in school and with parents.
Did you imagine that when you first started out or were you thinking only, I want to do something I love? 
Theo: No, we didn’t imagine it for sure. When we started, we said, maybe we’re going to play this venue in Berlin, once we get bigger, and that venue was about a hundred capacity.  We never played it because we started a little bit bigger, but that was our ceiling that we thought maybe we’d play in front of a hundred people.
How special is it to travel around the world with your partner, and to do what you love with your partner?
Victoria: It’s the best. 
Theo: I couldn’t imagine doing it alone, to be honest. 
It’s good that y’all have each other to lean on, because things can get stressful or tense out there, when you’re having a bad day. Do you ever take the energy from those moments where it’s not all perfect and turn it into music?
Theo: Not so much, because even if the song is sad, it comes out of a good place most of the time. If we’re not in a good mood, for me, it blocks my creativity. If I’m angry in the moment, I’m not creative. I can tap into the anger later, when I’m in a good mood, and then create out of that. What we produce usually comes from a good place.
Victoria: We sit down, drink some tequila shots, and if we’re not in a good mood, we try again the next day.
“If we’re not in a good mood, for me, it blocks my creativity. If I’m angry in the moment, I’m not creative. I can tap into the anger later, when I’m in a good mood, and then create out of that.” — Theo Zeitner
The music can be so loud and chaotic, rough even, but you create from such a beautiful place. That says a lot about how you move through the world. You two have a new album coming out soon?
Theo: Yes, I’m really excited. We never worked on anything ever that hard, it was a year full of intense sessions, ten-to-fourteen-hour days. We worked with a lot of different people for the first time. I’m still the main producer but we got some influence from other producers and worked with samples. It’s well thought out and crafted. It’s ambitious. It could go south, go badly, so much emotion went into it. But we hope that people will understand it and like it, because it is different for sure.
Victoria: It’s different, but it’s still us. As long as you’re true to yourself. It’s better to put that out there rather than something that might work but is not true to you.
You want to do what makes you happy that’s the most important.
Theo: Yeah, but sometimes you forget. You go so far in the process that you think, what was even the point of it? What do I want to say in the end? This is what we’re finding out. That’s why we delayed it a little bit. We have a strong foundation of the record and we wanted badly to release it this year, because we didn’t release anything. And you have to show the people you’re still alive, you’re still here. This is kind of a scary moment for us, because we didn’t show ourselves for a while, and now we’re coming with what’s going to be a sixteen-track record. I’m going to have some sleepless nights before, for sure.
Victoria: Me too!
Is there a track on there that’s your favourite that you’re excited for everyone to hear? 
Victoria: It changes all the time for me.
Theo: We have some cool features that we’re not going to say yet. I hope it plays out well in the end. We have surprising features and big stuff in there. In general, I’m wanting to see how people will react to the surprises. There’s dubstep, then there’s a three-minute interlude with a nice story above it. There’s some crazy shit in it. I can’t wait for people to talk about it, even if they hate it. I want to see and hear what people think, because in the end, it’s for them.
That’s what art is supposed to do, get people talking. You’re doing that, experimenting, trying new things, and expressing yourselves. Are there any artists that you wanted or producers that you haven’t worked with, that you want to?
Theo: Let’s go classic like Skrillex. I love him, and I think he’s one of the best producers. So that would be exciting, and it changes all the time. But definitely we want to work with some punk bands like Amyl and The Sniffers, the Australian punk band. That hasn’t happened yet, but maybe it will in the future. Maybe with a real band with drums and stuff. And this new kind of EDM scene that is experimental and by young people, that make me feel old, maybe work with those people. Jane Remover is cool. We got a lot of stuff on the record that is already a dream come true. 
That’s cool, I hope that happens one day. With all the success you’ve been having, how do you stay grounded and protect that sense of home?
Victoria: For me, it’s friends and family and our home base, and always getting back to that. We still have exactly the same friend group, and it’s everything, it doesn’t get better than that. At home, the movies, your best friends, life doesn’t get better. You can always go back to that. Of course, you can go and have a super expensive crazy lifestyle. But that isn’t sustainable. You can do it once in a while, but it won’t make you very happy. We are always grounded.
Theo: We’re always seeking comfort. I think that the friend group is the main thing, because it never changed. In the four years we’ve been successful, it is a hundred per cent the same friends we had eight or ten years ago. That is what keeps us grounded. We also work with some of them, which is nice, the photoshoot we did, the photographer is one of our best friends.
That’s dope you get to work together. Everybody is becoming successful together. You’re happy for them and they’re happy for you.
Theo: Exactly, it’s this house we built together. The graphic designer’s always the same, the photographers are always the same. Now we’re back working with the same vocal recorder and vocal processing, which is one of our best friends. We went through it together.
It kind of makes things easier, coming into the music scene already knowing people who do creative stuff. Has it ever been tricky, though, trying to navigate work?
Theo: At times. We grew into this with friends, no one was really in the industry. I would say we didn’t have any contacts. But now it is definitely easier because our friends are already talented. We have friends who are good photographers, and now they are in demand. Everyone got better and better at what they do, and we still work with them, even on a big scale.
Victoria: I don’t love to work with strangers, especially in music. I mean, now we work with some people who I love, I was recording with Dylan Brady from 100 gecs and Alex [Ridha], Boys Noize. But when it’s a complete stranger, I don’t feel that comfortable.
If someone came up to you and said, “I want to do what you’re doing,” what advice would you give them from what you’ve learned on your journey so far?
Victoria: I think you need to find something unique, also you need to be lucky, a piece of it is luck. 
Theo: I would love to say, if you have your voice and you keep at it, you will be successful. But I don’t think that’s true, it’s not a given that it will happen. 
I love the fact that you both love what you do. This entire interview you’ve been so happy and full of laughter. I love that you have this type of energy, it comes from a genuine place. Are there boundaries you create to make sure you keep certain things sacred and only to yourself? 
Victoria: I share what I want to share. This is very important to me. We don’t do that many interviews; we’re not on social media much. Once in a while we upload a TikTok. Our managers are angry, they feel we should do more. We feel it’s not us. It would be awkward.
Theo: This whole new closeness to an artist, they want to see on TikTok, for example, they do not want to see a video of our show. They want to see us getting ready or brushing our teeth. The term parasocial is trending right now, where fans feel they know the artist way more than they do. I feel uncomfortable with it, it’s not even that I find it uncool. I feel stupid talking in front of a camera. 
With social media, fans have a big parasocial relationship with artists. But you two are not very into posting those TikToks. You mentioned the album got pushed back, was there a specific reason?
Theo: It’s just we weren’t finished. We toured the whole summer, and we put too much on our plate. We agreed, okay, if we finish this now it’s not going to be good. 
You were touring and recording at the same time, were you in different studios in each city?
Theo: The record is kind of globe-trotting, a record that was recorded in a lot of places.
What’s your favourite place you’ve been to so far?
Theo: Very boring, but New York is my favourite. I like it the most. I’m a big sucker for this romanticised New York you see in the movies, and then actually experiencing it. I love that. But even LA feels like home now, and we have friends there. I like America, apart from the fucking politics and everything, I feel kind of at home.
Yes, apart from the politics.
Theo: It’s scary like 1930s Germany, it’s very scary right now.
I call LA home although I’m in the San Francisco area right now.
Victoria: We went to San Francisco for the first time this year. It felt not real, like a film set, I was wondering if the city is really there, but it was amazing. I had the best time. Also, the nature around there was crazy with amazing trees. I was stunned. There were coyotes and turkeys walking next to the car.
It is very scenic up here. I’m glad you guys enjoyed it.
Theo: I mean, our favourite city is still Berlin.
Well, I would like to come visit Berlin, so maybe show me around. 
Victoria: Yes.
Theo: Nothing has ever beaten it so far.
Victoria: No, nothing.
A friend of mine visited Berlin, and he said, the clubs go crazy.
Theo: We don’t do it as much anymore, but it does. It’s this kind of freedom I don’t think you find anywhere. It’s like nowhere in the world. 
Victoria: If you come, we can take you out.
I would love that!
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Full look LOUIS VUITTON.
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Top and skirt 032C, tights PRAYING.
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From left to right: Creature wears jacket 032C; Theo wears tracksuit EGONLAB, cap PALACE, shoes SCAROSSO; Victoria wears jumper and shirt 3.PARADIS, trousers HED MAYNER, beanie KNWLS, shoes OTTOLINGER.
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From left to right: Theo wears full look BURBERRY; Victoria wears top and skirt 032C, tights PRAYING.
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Suit JOHN LAWRENCE SULLIVAN, sneakers LOUIS VUITTON, tank top stylist’s own.
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Full look ASHLEY WILLIAMS.
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From left to right: Theo wears jacket PALACE, T-shirt VANS x SLAM JAM, trousers ALICE HOLLYWOOD, shoes PDF; Victoria wears jacket MAISON MIHARA YASUHIRO, T-shirt 8IGB, trousers stylist’s own, shoes OTTOLINGER.
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Theo and Victoria wear full looks RICK OWENS.